I agree. That’s one reason why I chose to hold back on the 4th definition for so long. But… the community has spoken.

The Pagaini followed the Earth based religions of their ancestors and worshipped the old Gods and Goddesses. When the “new” religion of Christianity was spreading, it was practiced mostly in the cities. Therefore the Pagani became associated at the time with those who did NOT follow the “new” religion of Christianity. Over time this association was extended to include Judaism and Islam. Therefore, the fourth definition is still applicable.

At the same time, the fourth definition may be two broad for use today. For example; there are many these days who follow Native American religious practices who would feel insulted if they were referred to as “Pagan”, even though they practice a religion which honors the Earth. Likewise, there are many Hindus, Buddhists, Sikhs and others who would NOT consider themselves Pagan, even though they do follow non-Abrahamic faiths.

This is my gut reaction too. But then I see interviews of people in Norway and other Northern European countries who are largely irreligious and seem well adjusted and happy. It seems very strange to me, but it does make me wonder.

OTOH, our tradition’s concept of compassion also includes passion toward self, which, for me, making sure my own truth is heard in the debate. I consider this especially important when folks try to make sweeping statements of “truth” about “what Pagans know” (especially when they couch it as knowledge rather than belief. So even if I’m among fellow Pagans, if someone says, “Well, all Pagans know that blahblahgeneralizationcakes,” I will, with as much compassion towards all of us as I can, say that some Pagans, such as *this one sitting in front of them*, “know” otherwise. Sometimes this upsets people, but by and large I’ve found folks appreciate a gentle reminder of our vibrant diversity.

I find this juxtaposition of ‘truth’ and ‘compassion’ difficult. I think the term ‘truth’ is too strong a word here. I do believe there is such a thing as objective truth, but I also believe that we humans can only ever partly possess it. I do believe that science is our best method for understanding the world, but still it cannot fully escape our human limitations and biases. Although I often don’t succeed, I try to remember this when talking to people whose beliefs are very different from my own.

Generally I don’t go around trying to dissuade people of their “false” beliefs (i.e. beliefs not supported by scientific evidence and opinion), not because I’m trying to be compassionate or because I’ve made some kind of utilitarian harm/benefit calculation, but because in general it seems a waste of time or at least I’m not very good at changing people’s deeply held, emotionally charged, beliefs (which are usually the ones that matter). These days everyone seems to have their own facts, and even when facts are not in dispute, those facts can often support a wide variety of legitimate interpretations. I do enjoy talking about various kinds of facts and interpretations and expressing my opinion on issues when it is appropriate to do so, but there is something kind of condescending in the notion of shielding people from the “Truth” out of compassion.

Thanks for the reply. With so many details and nuances in every family situation, I’m not in a position to know if you handled things the best way possible. I think first and foremost that you at least didn’t do more damage by simply say there was a god, and so are doing better than so many other parents out there on that point. Being a parent is indeed a challenge (I’m a parent too). A general rule I use is to remember that if a child is old enough to ask the question, they are often old enough to hear the real answer. Also, I remind myself that children, before age 9-10 or so, are concrete literalists. They cannot understand many abstract ideas and nuances. When they ask “is there a God?”, they mean that image taught in churches, simple as that. The nuances can be added, but should be only after saying that the god taught in the bible doesn’t exist (if one is being open with them at that point).

For the death issue, that is a really hard thing to face. If it’s been hidden from them until something traumatic happens (like a grandparent dies), then they have deal with two tough things at once. So I try to start making it clear to kids early on that everything alive will die some day, and especially that death is not bad, shameful, or evil, but rather a natural part of the world – without which nothing good would be around. See Connie Barlow’s death stuff here for tons of resources on this very point: http://www.thegreatstory.org/death-programs.html . I’ve got a story about explaining death to a 4 year old that I hope to come back to post (no time now).

Yes, critical thinking is a key gift we, as parents need to make sure the kids have – they’ll really need it, as will future generations.

All the best- -Equinox

Great. WordPress won’t let you edit your comments, unfortunately. Tell you what: why don’t you make your edits and send it to me in a Word doc. You can include your further comment, and anything else you prefer too. Send to: humanisticpaganism [at] gmail [dot] com. I would like to publish it Monday at the latest, if possible.

Thanks!